Powered by Max Banner Ads
I see a lot of vitriol directed against infertile couples who access fertility treatment on the NHS (ie "having children is not a right/infertility is not an illness/NHS funds shouldn’t be wasted on infertilie treatment" blah blah).
And yet when you think about it, a lot of NHS money is wasted on treating people who have, through their own choices, MADE themselves ill – ie for example those who drink excessively or abuse drugs.
So if certain procedures, such as fertility treatment, should be made private-only, does this also apply to those whose deliberate actions have caused them to need NHS treatment?
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/22/20091231/tuk-uk-britain-hangovers-fa6b408.html
Patrick – there is a differnce between enjoying a drink and knowing how to behave responsibly with alcohol (ie what you can/can’t tolerate, how much you can hold before you need to stop etc) and ending up face down in a puddle of puke on the pavement, wasting police, ambulance and hospital time and money!
John D – why target infertile people? Don’t they pay taxes too? The costs of fertility treatment (£6,000+ per cycle for IVF) put it out of the reach of many loving couples who would make excellent parents – they may not be able to get their hands on this kind of cash!!! Oh and don’t trot out the "adoption" line, thats become a complete minefield these days.
Binge Drinkers are creating their own illnesses, which is why they should pay for it, or make the decision not to binge drink. If you are old enough to drink alcohol you should be mature enough to make adult decisions and be responsible.
I think it should be brought in where people have been ‘binge’ drinking (in particular). We all know the dangers of binge drinking….. who hasn’t heard of someone dyeing by drowning in their own vomit after binge drinking? We’ve all seen resuls of binge drinking on the telly as well, where the police and ambulance crew have to deal with people that are so drunk that they cannot even walk without falling over and hurting themselves (and others). These people should be made to pay for emergency services, and it might just clean the streets up of this filth a little bit. Faced with a £500 plus bill might make this street scum think twice about throwing gallons of liquor down themselves if they didn’t get any more ‘free’ treatment.
I agree with you about drink and drugs, but I don’t think fertility treatment should be available on the NHS.
References :
Probably yes . same as car accident casualties often have to contribute , via their insurances . yes drinking , drugs , smoking,obesity .. free treatment is only if you give the vices up and go on courses to rectify matters and improve health . If you continue ,, hard luck . pay or die . fertility and cosmetic treatments should be private medicine only
References :
I agree with you. I do not think that people should be given transplants when they have made themselves ill, like livers for alcoholics. This may seem harsh but at the end of it all most people haven’t done anything to not be able to conceive, where as people with drink and drug addiction related illnesses have made themselves ill.
I know some of the people struggling with addiction have psychological problems, or have had bad experiences in their lives, but so have I, and i have survived. I think people that have caused themselves to be ill should pay a supplement towards the treatment they receive.
References :
Great idea, but impossible to enforce. Emergency staff have to face enough violence without having to extract money or ID from friday night drunks. The only way to do it would be to have a secure area in every A&E department with cells to keep the ones who refuse to pay.
You could slap some extra tax on drinks but that punishes the responsible drinkers.
References :
I think that would be fair. I also think that drug dealers assets should be placed in the hands of the NHS too.
References :
It all depends on the circumstances, if they are just drunk /drugged off their heads falling about being sick and generally out of it then yes. Also i think it is such a shame that people have to pay for IVF, for wanting a child so badly that would be loved so much. I have come in contact with alcoholics and drug abusers with my previous job, and i agree that all this rehabilitation and help that they are given can be a waste of money, as they are going in 3 and 4 times and coming out and starting on the drink/drugs straight away. I have seen this so many times.
References :
Absolutely not, and if they are a smoker as well, they should not only get treatment free, they should be pushed to the front of the queue and given private rooms, decent menu’s, colour tv and Sky.
I smoke and drink, do you have any idea how much more I pay in tax than the none smoking none drinking types that have the nerve to use my NHS for their trivial skin problems or corns or general knocks and bumps.
References :
No they shouldn’t. No-one should have to pay directly for hospital treatment, regardless of why it was caused. The real rip-off in the NHS is the billions wasted on consultancy fees, PFI schemes, the internal market and private contractors. Compared to that, a few million spent on treating drunks at New Year pales into insignificance.
Are we now living in such a nanny state that we can’t even get drunk at Christmas or New Year?
References :
http://www.keepournhspublic.com
Yes they should – this huge problem is getting completely out of hand now. Self-inflicted as you’ve said by people who will not control there level of booze intake and drug users who have no intention of giving up there habit.
Easy enough too collect and enforce the ‘fines’ – deduct from there wages if working – deduct from there benefits in not working. Hit them hard in their pockets – that will make them all stop and think before embarking on ‘binge drinking’ with ‘less money too spend’ – with drug users ‘force’ them into treatment centres or take them of the streets by jailing them – the choice is theres.
Fertility treatment too be paid for by the couples concerned – or they don’t have kids – this system has been abused for years – women who have already got kids wanting ‘more’ via this treatment.
Drunken and violent behaviour and drug taking are the 3 worst ‘anti-social’ acts in this country today.!!
These actions if carried out would save the NHS millions very year.!!
References :
We have a real problem here in pleasing all the parties that seek help from the NHS.I fully endorse your comment about the drunks that fill up the A&E at the week-ends, because the majority of the drunks are classed as self-induced.
However you know and I know, that once you single out a particular group, you are opening a mine field, because you will get people who oppose other self inflicted health problems, shouting for them to be also singled out.
So now comes the crunch, do we have the right to deny anyone medical help, whether its caused by a bad life style or otherwise?
Or are we entering a dictatorship within the NHS and help only those people who are lucky enough to live a healthy life, which in its self is not compulsory but still a free choice.
References :
I think it should be brought in where people have been ‘binge’ drinking (in particular). We all know the dangers of binge drinking….. who hasn’t heard of someone dyeing by drowning in their own vomit after binge drinking? We’ve all seen resuls of binge drinking on the telly as well, where the police and ambulance crew have to deal with people that are so drunk that they cannot even walk without falling over and hurting themselves (and others). These people should be made to pay for emergency services, and it might just clean the streets up of this filth a little bit. Faced with a £500 plus bill might make this street scum think twice about throwing gallons of liquor down themselves if they didn’t get any more ‘free’ treatment.
References :
Yes of course.
References :
Why target drinkers? The vast majority of them have paid a fortune in taxes on the alcohol that has made them ill. If you don’t want to treat them then drop the tax on alcohol, same as cigarettes, and I don’t smoke.
While I have every sympathy for couples struggling to have children, if they want them so bad then a financial sacrifice isn’t to big of a burden to undertake. You also have the case where lesbian couples are having it done free.
Fertility treatment, plastic surgery, etc are personal choices and should be funded by the people that want the treatment. We now have the scenario that sex changes, rhinoplasty and breast augmentation are done for free, all in the name of vanity.
Edit,
My point LadyMoon is that the NHS is part funded by taxes on alcohol and cigarettes. It would, in my opinion, be wrong to tax harmful products, like alcohol and cigarettes, and then deny people treatment that they have already indirectly paid for.
References :
WHAT are national insurance payments taken from your wages used for? The tax that the government gets from alcohol and cigarettes is astronomical. All these monies go towards the NHS so people with illnesses related to tobacco and alcohol have more than paid for their treatment.Thank you very much.
Why not target asylum seekers and health tourists who come here and get medical treatment for free? Not a penny payed into the system but they get the same treatment as someone who has paid into the system for years then get denied life saving drugs because they are too `expensive’
Infertility is very sad but it is not an illness. It is a God given gift to have a child and someone may have 10 children as may someone may have none. It is the lottery of life.
The NHS was never set up to pay for gender changing operations, cosmetic surgery or infertility treatments. Sorry but a sad fact of life.
References :
No, sort NHS finances out and reverse governments attempts to create a two tier system.
References :
lots of these drunken idiots have paid into the system….so yes – they should be cared for by the NHS – if not…where do we draw the line….do we stop caring for Fat people just because they cause their own diseases. we have a duty of care.
References :
How about prosecuting the suppliers?
References :
As soon as you make people pay for NHS treatment you create a 2 tier system.
Once the 2 tier system is in place who else will have to pay? Smokers? The overweight? People requiring IVF? Old age pensioners?
Yes, a lot of money is wasted by alcohol abuse but a lot more is wasted by drug abuse and ‘health tourism’ why not pick on those people instead?
HTH
References :
Everyone pays NI contributions here in UK – thus they are entitled to free at point of need medical care, even if their injury or injuries has been brought on by binge drinking and loutish behaviour.
you must be a Tory!
References :
Yes and so should smokers!
References :
No. Speaking as somebody who has been lucky enough not to have needed a doctor for over ten years, I don’t think it’s a good idea. If you said that for drinkers, then you would have to do the same for smokers, people on poor diets, drug users, careless people who had unnecessary accidents, in fact just about everybody. Anyway, unless I’m mistaken, many people do get fertility treatment on the NHS. I know for a fact they used to, because the wife of a man I used to work with had it. She had twins.
Oh, I’ve just read this, thanks to Google:
"According to government recommendations in the UK, infertile couples who meet the correct criteria and who have no children either from their current or a previous relationship, should be entitled to three cycles of IVF treatment paid for by the British National Health Service (NHS). "
http://www.womens-health.co.uk/IVF-NHS.html
References :